NathanielsMama

  LIVE lN PEACE:  hmm, your profile seems familar.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  this is victor, the crazy guy that's gonna eliminate money and bring world peace.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  ring a bell? 

 NathanielsMama:  yes, I remember. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  cool, i thought so 

 NathanielsMama:  I read about all your crazy adventures, etc. But, I'm not convinced you have a plan that's going to work, sorry. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  that's ok..i can't expect everyone to agree with me..you haven't been through the same learning experiences i have.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  my stuff is spreading like wildfire on the web.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  what all of my stuff have you read? 

 NathanielsMama:  that's good. congratulations 

 NathanielsMama:  I read about the trips to Berkkely and Oregon and the stint in the West Texas Prison.. and again in Wimberly? or was it New Braunfels?   

 LIVE lN PEACE:  san marcos.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  cool, you seem to be up to date.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  thanks for actually reading them 

 NathanielsMama:  sure, I love hearing about road trips... i'm pretty experienced at that myself 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  then what exactly do you think will not work about my plan? 

 NathanielsMama:  people just aren't going to buy it.  There are too many fucked up individuals (fucked up due to the way  they were parented/raised) that are not going to give up the "control" issues they have .... and earning money is one of those things that people with control issues like to do. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  anything is possible and you gotta start somewhere... 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  i've planted the seeds and i'm making sure my garden grows.. 

 NathanielsMama:  there just isn't a "blanket" method you can apply to all people to help them overcome their insecurites/control issues and find inner peace.  that's why there are so many type of religions/philosophies in the world.... because there are so many different paths to finding peace. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  it's simple evolution...don't you see what the existance of pirated software means on the global-scale?  there is a way to obtain things with value, not pay for them, AND get away with it.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  what more clearer sign does anyone need? 

 NathanielsMama:  I'm sure you'll be successful in reaching some people but, not everyone is going to relate to you and you can't "break down" and "undo" years and years of thick walls that people build up around themselves due to the crappy way they were  treated as children.   

 LIVE lN PEACE:  anyone with an interenet connection can do it, too 

 NathanielsMama:  I understand all that.... but, there are plenty of people out there WHO LIKE making money and paying for stuff, because they feel guilty if t hey don't pay for stuff, etc. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  well, when generosity becomes the mainstream...people will be peer-pressured into changing 

 NathanielsMama:  I don't think peer-pressure can undo years of psychological/emotional trauma.  I think you've failed to take the psychological/spiritual side of human nature into full consideration. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  in the back of everybody's minds...they all agree with me.. 

 NathanielsMama:  I m not arguing your ideals/philosophy, you understand that right?  I'm just arguing that there is "one" medicine (ie. yours or anyone's) that is going to cure everyone on the planet 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  they're just too scared of the system to speak out 

 NathanielsMama:  that's awfully self-centered and egotistical, don't you think? to believe that everyone agrees with you. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  the internet is a global-medium...if i cant reach the entire population of earth, i can at least come close to it.. 

 NathanielsMama:  but the "system" starts in the HOME with your parents... that's where the indoctrination begins. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  no, not at all...i think everyone knows that everyone is different 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  don't you? 

 NathanielsMama:  of course, I do.  But, there are people out there who wouldn't agree/understand. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  what kind of idiot would think everyone's the same? 

 NathanielsMama:  there are a lot of idiots in this world. Would you disagree with that statement? 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  exactly, it's all the parent's fault...kids have always known better..we have the advantage of learning from our parent's mistakes without having to make them ourselves.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  well, it's never too late to become what you might've been.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  being an idiot doesn't have to be a permanent thing 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  anyone can learn 

 NathanielsMama:  but, it's not the parent's fault actually.... because they are just playing out all the crap they inherited from their parents and their parents before them.... it's a viscious cycle.   

 LIVE lN PEACE:  but not everyone wants to 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  it's their fault for not accepting change, even when it's for the better 

 NathanielsMama:  I agree. everyone can learn.  But you have to be willing to learn and tell me, "WHat makes a person WANT/DESIRE to learn?" 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  and makes more rational 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  hmm 

 NathanielsMama:  I agree, everyone needs to take responsibility and stop blaming their parents or society or the government or ANYONE OR ANYTHING for their problems and the world's problems. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  that's exactly right...everyone needs to take responsibility... 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  world peace will have to be everyone's fault 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  not just mine 

 NathanielsMama:  OK, let me re-phrase this question: "What makes people NOT want to learn?" 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  laziness, among other things.. 

 NathanielsMama:  yes, laziness is a good one.... what else? 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  complacency 

 NathanielsMama:  that's kind of in the same category... why do you think people are naturally lazy and complacent? 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  because they're too preoccupied trying to fit in 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  trying to be the same 

 NathanielsMama:  not everyone... that's not everyone's excuse 

 NathanielsMama:  nor do I think that is the "main" reason people are lazy/complacent 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  and i don't think they're naturally lazy and complacent 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  they are conditioned that way.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  it's human nature to be generous.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  and peaceful 

 NathanielsMama:  regardless.... there are still a heck of a lot of complacent people out there 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  i would say the existance of money is a big reason 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  if not the main one.. 

 NathanielsMama:  I'd say that it's also human nature to be greedy and aggressive also.... we are ALL these things.  

 LIVE lN PEACE:  i don't buy that...if money didn't exist..neither would greed so much..and if it was still around..wouldn't it occur so much less? 

 NathanielsMama:  I think money is "symptom" of our innate complacency NOT the reason..... it's a chicken-egg thing. 

 NathanielsMama:  But people aren't just greedy about money.... they are greedy for attention, fame and other things. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  but with most of the things people are greedy about...it can all be traced back to money... 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  it's the root 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  what better way to get attention and fame than to have lots of money? 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  happiness can be bought for a little more than free..why does everyone want to put a pricetag on things? 

 NathanielsMama:  their had to be a "reason" to create money.... so obviously money came after the fact.... I will agree with you that it helps keep us imprisoned in the same narrow-minded frame of living but, since it didn't create our problems.... our problems created money... how can you deduct logically then that removing money is going to remove our problems? 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  true..money was an idea created by humans...but i see it as a mistake..and it has snowballed into this evil monster that's gonna end up killing our world 

 NathanielsMama:  money is a fast ticket to a "kind" of attention/fame..... but, that's not the kind of fame/attention everyone wants.... on a smaller scale, someone may desire/be greedy for the attention of a specific person.  Usually that specific person triggers some subconscious representation of a parent that did not give them the attention they needed as a child..... so they seek it in others as adults.  People are greedy because they beleive there is not enough "love" for them to go around... so they cling to people/t 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  it's just not necessary 

 NathanielsMama:  or things (LIKE MONEY) because they think it's going to fill the void. 

 NathanielsMama:  I think there are basically ONLY TWO things that motivate human beings into the behaviours/actions they display: those TWO things are LOVE or FEAR. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  money is a huge motivator for what people decide to do.. 

 NathanielsMama:  yes, because of what money represents.... not money itself! 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  it's what our lives our lived for 

 NathanielsMama:  because we've lost the connection to things that are more fulfilling in our lives 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  yeah, and once everyone stops paying for stuff with the internet...the value of money will dissapear 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  it's the next step.. 

 NathanielsMama:  but, that will not replace the voids/fears in people's hearts from the lack of love/fulfillment they received as a child. 

 NathanielsMama:  or I meant did NOT receive as a child 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  when generosity becomes the mainstream...EVERYONE will get exactly what they need.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  earth will become one big ball of love 

 NathanielsMama:  You are attacking this problem from one side only... there are two sides: there is an "outside" and "inside".... you are treating the symptoms.... not the disease. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  no..up until me, humans have been too preoccupied treating the symptoms(and charging money for it)..i believe i have found the cure.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  and i'm gonna give it away 

 NathanielsMama:  People have to believe they are WORTHY of love/generosity.... don't you see what I am saying? I am sure you know a lot of people who don't feel they are worthy.... they've told themselves this because they didn't receive love as a child... so they tell themselves "It must be because I 'm not worthy." 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  people deserve love just for being human..in my eyes 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  EVERYONE is worthy..no matter what atrocities they have commited.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  99% of "crimes" that put people in jail are rooted in money.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  if money didn't exist, those crimes would have never been committed 

 NathanielsMama:  I agree with you 100%.... but there are  a lot of people out there that dont feel worthy because there experience as a child and into adulthood has not suported that beleif. 

 NathanielsMama:  If people didn't feel unloved, if people didn't feel incomplete.... then people would not desire to fill themselves with "physical and material" things and money would lose it's importance. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  well, when these people are forgiven and cared for, don't you think they will feel indebted and not do bad things anymore? 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  they're only human.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  exactly 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  so let's love everyone 

 NathanielsMama:  Self-forgiveness is something that ONLY you can give yourself.... it doesn't matter how many people tell you that you are fogiven.... until you can forgive yourself...it doesn't happen 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  let's make things all right 

 NathanielsMama:  People only give love when they feel loved. 

 NathanielsMama:  People only feel love when they know love. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  you can't generalize like that.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  persons maybe.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  are you saying it's impossible for there to be any exceptions to that? 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  have i ever sent you my collection of quotes? 

 NathanielsMama:  no, I'm not .... I'm just trying to share a different perspective with you... one that says there are two sides to this problem: internal and external.... and that I really think you are only treating the external in your attempts.  I'm not saying abandon your attempts at solving the external..,... I am just *suggesting* that you start looking at the internal and what makes people tick.... what obstacles have to be removed "internally" before they will see the expternal problems 

 NathanielsMama:  yes, I saw  them.  I agree with some, I disagreed with others. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  ok, just checking.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  i have been logging each day of my life for some time now.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  i come across so much generosity every single day, that it's kinda hard for me to think otherwise.. 

 NathanielsMama:  Have you ever heard the parable of the elephant? it's a buddhist parable 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  now, when my website is up..it will serve as evidence.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  in black and white 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  no, i don't think so 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  what's your name, sister? 

 NathanielsMama:  ahhhhhh! but the world is not black and white.... but composed of infinite shades of grey! do you want to hear the parable? 

 NathanielsMama:  Juliet 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  that's right 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  yes, please 

 NathanielsMama:  OK, let me remember how it begins.... 

 NathanielsMama:  Once upon a time there was king who had a theory he wanted to test.  WIthout revealing his secret, the king ordered his attendents to bring together all the men in the city who had been blind from birth.  After all the blind men in the city had been brought to the kings palace, they were brought into a courtyard where there was an elephant... 

 NathanielsMama:  The king had the blind men form a circle around the elephant.  He instructed the men to come forward and touch the elephant to see what it was like.  Some of the blind men touched the elephant's face, other's the trunk, or a leg, or the tail, or the body. 

 NathanielsMama:  The king asked them all, "Do you now know what an elephant is like?"  They all replied, "Yes, we do."  So the king led the elephant away and asked, "Tell me, each of you, what is an elephant like?" 

 NathanielsMama:  The blind men who had felt the head said, "Oh, your majesty, the elephant is like an a huge water-pot."  Whereas the man who touched the ears said, "Your majesty, an elephant feels just like a royal fan."  Others who had felt the tusks said, "No, it is like a strong plow."  One after the other, each blind man described the elephant according the the part he had touched/experienced. 

 NathanielsMama:  But, when all the men heard the different responses, they thought surely the others' were lying to their king!  Right away an argument broke out among them. 

 NathanielsMama:  But, the king said, the TRUTH is like this... each of you believes only what they have felt or seen or experienced.  The moral of the story is "If you wish to know the truth, hold no opinions." 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  i agree..everybody has their own, individual reality.  what may be true to you may not be true to me..but, we still live in the same exact world.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  and there are some truths that are just too self-evident to argue.. 

 NathanielsMama:  yes, and the point I was also trying to make is that there is more than one way to find truth... there is more than one way to see the truth. 

 NathanielsMama:  The Truth is greater than any one person (you or I or anyone) or anyone religion or philosophy that has EVER existed. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  i don't think i know it all..in fact, i am positive i don't..that would make me perfect.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  and to err is human.. 

 NathanielsMama:  The truth is like a blind man touching part of an elephant....  

 NathanielsMama:  that's what I said.... re-read what I wrote.. 

 NathanielsMama:  the TRUTH is GREATER than any one person... it's greater than  anything one person can conceive, do, think, beleive, know.... it's impossible for ANYONE person or group of people to know the  *entire* TRUTH ..... at best we can only come to partial truths about anything 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  as long as what you believe makes you happy(and doesn't infringe on me), i don't want you to think any other way.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  just bear me the same respect.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  and i'm speaking you in general 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  but would anyoen argue the fact that no one is the same? 

 NathanielsMama:  it doesn't matter what you "want" or not... it won't change what I or anyone else beleives anyway.... besides, I don't think you are getting my point 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  what greater truth than that? 

 NathanielsMama:  there are people who don't want to beleive that we are not all the same... that we are not all equal.... that's why democracy was created... and communism too, for that matter.  

 LIVE lN PEACE:  well, in the end..time will tell.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  but so will i 

 NathanielsMama:  I am  saying that the Ultimate Truth about anything is "incomprehensible"..... you can know *something* about the Truth, but never everything because human beings are too "finite" to comprehend something as infinite as the Truth. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  but how could you possibly know that for sure? 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  i have found perfection in accepting imperfection.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  and thus, being imperfect myself.. 

 NathanielsMama:  just the reality of the world..... that everyone and every culture has always believed that they have the answers when the truth is that everyone only has PART of the answer.... to know ALL you would have to BE ALL and since we are FINITE beings, we can only know a FINITE reality/portion of the Truth, do you understand now? 

 NathanielsMama:  I found perfection undesirable 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  sure..perfectly..all we can know of life is only what we have discovered so far.. 

 NathanielsMama:  Do you know that it was the concept of Heaven that actually turned me off of Christianity.... I thought to myself at the ripe age of 8.... How boring is that?  Who wants to go to someplace as boring and perfect as heaven??? 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  i'm in the same boat...i don't believe in life after death..but hey, anything's possible.. 

 NathanielsMama:  And, what I see is you trying to create a virtual heaven on earth.... I think it's boring and I think we would lose all the challenges that make us into better human beings.  We need obstacles. We need challenges. We need injustices. 

 NathanielsMama:  We need disparities. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  i think that when i die, i will be dead..i will cease to exist..i won't give a damn if i go to heaven or hell..because dead people don't give much a shit about anything 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  no, we dont need any of those.. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  we like having them 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  but why do we want what we dont need? 

 NathanielsMama:  if we don't have those, what will challenge us to learn, to grow, to seek, to explore? 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  ourselves 

 NathanielsMama:  because we don't really know what we need? 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  we know the basics 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  the human mind is instinctly curious...always wanting to know what's on the other side of the mountain 

 NathanielsMama:  the world is unfolding exactly as it should... the only thing we need to change is ourselves 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  we wont stop being productive and advancing if we take away money... 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  just the opposite..we will advance faster 

 NathanielsMama:  ah, curiosity won't bring us deeper inside our own souls... to know our weaknesses and to learn how to strenthen them 

 NathanielsMama:  Example:  I have an ex-husband. 

 LIVE lN PEACE:  ex huh, have you learned your lesson? 

NathanielsMama: At the time when I was going through my divorce, I was very angry with him.  Then I became angry with myself for making poor choices in choosing him and how I dealt with him.... later... as time went by, I learned that he challenged me in ways I'd never otherwise be challenged and to look at and examine myelf from perspectives I would never have occured to look from

NathanielsMama: Now, although I am grateful for the opportunities he provided me to learn from, I am still assured that I made the right choice in leaving him.

LIVE lN PEACE: good, you found the brighter side..

LIVE lN PEACE: formal marriage is so unnecessary

NathanielsMama: Becoming a mother was the same thing.  I see myself from a different perspective because the challenges and obstacles my child provides me with cause me to look from different angles and to look deeper within to find solutions

LIVE lN PEACE: it keeps you on your toes..

LIVE lN PEACE: but what's to say you wouldn't have kept yourself on your toes if you hadn't been through these things?

NathanielsMama: exctly.  we need stuff in this world to keep us on our toes.

LIVE lN PEACE: i dont

LIVE lN PEACE: just because it happened, doesnt mean it was necessary

NathanielsMama: because I changed very little in philosophy and perspective before I was married or had a child

LIVE lN PEACE: only because you didnt want to change without going through those experiences

NathanielsMama: Pain is a necessary part of growing.  Allowing yourself to experience pain fully is what will allow you to realize your lessons fully.  Pain is weakness leaving the body.

LIVE lN PEACE: you can always learn from other people's mistakes and not have to make them yourself

LIVE lN PEACE: the less pain, the better

LIVE lN PEACE: pain sucks

NathanielsMama: On some levels I agree with you. I did learn from my mother's mistakes.  But, there are some t hings you really have to FULLY experience and immerse yourself in before you can truly understand it and transcend it.

NathanielsMama: I m not afraid of pain.  It's apart of life.  

LIVE lN PEACE: maybe you

LIVE lN PEACE: i'm not afraid of it either..doesn't mean i'm not going to try to avoid it as much as i can

LIVE lN PEACE: who likes going through pain?

NathanielsMama: no one... but, I think (for myself) that it is sometimes necessary in growing, I can accept it.

NathanielsMama: it is because people avoid/fear pain that they have disparities between the Truth and their reality.

LIVE lN PEACE: just because it happened and that's the only way you learned, doesnt mean it was necessary..

LIVE lN PEACE: "There's a better way to do it.  Find it!"

- Thomas Edison

NathanielsMama: it starts in childhood.  As a child, we are "hardwired" to believe that our parents are nothing more than nurturing, perfect, loving parents.  But, as a small child whenever a parent does something to us that isn't nurturing, loving, and perfect, we cannot allow ourselves to "fully" experience that pain or truth... so, at first, we re-write reality to make the adjustment.  People tend to have one of two ways they alter reality... either by blaming external circumstances... or internal circumstances....

LIVE lN PEACE: but we have the right to choose what is real and what isnt, to us..

NathanielsMama: ie. they either internalize the pain the experienced from their parents unloving actions by beleiving it was "their fault" or they blame it on environmental circumstances.... example: if dad hadn't lost his job, then he wouldn't be depressed and drinking nd then he would have remembered to pick me up from school

LIVE lN PEACE: it may seem like an altered reality to others, but it's ours nonetheless

NathanielsMama: YES we do! very good!

LIVE lN PEACE: when people ask me what i do, i tell them i'm a designer

LIVE lN PEACE: that i design my own reality..

LIVE lN PEACE: that i set daily projects for myself when i wake up, and i follow through

LIVE lN PEACE: that reminds me of a quote

LIVE lN PEACE: "To an outside observer a person's needs may be illusory or unrealistic, but they are still controlling."

- Keith Davis

NathanielsMama: But, there is a line of therapuetic thinking that beleives if we allow ourselves to go back and experience that pain, that we can transcend it and therefore re-align ourselves with the Truth.  And when we are in alignment with the TRuth, our actions will follow apporpriately.  If we see without blinders, then we can act with the full information of the experience of oour lives.

NathanielsMama: exactly!!!! Yes! Read what you just wrote!!!

NathanielsMama: we are CONTROLLED by our inner imbalances/pain/weakness/voids

NathanielsMama: the key to unlocking the door of that prison is not fro the outside but from the INSIDE!

LIVE lN PEACE: in the end, that's what i'm preaching...i'm not trying to get everyone to agree with my reality...i want to give people the right to design their own..

NathanielsMama: good! it's the best thing for anyone. I totally agree.

LIVE lN PEACE: :]

LIVE lN PEACE: i still, for the life of everybody, can't find anything better to do..

LIVE lN PEACE: i've just had way too many great "coincidences" happen to me..that would make me think otherwise..

NathanielsMama: people want to come to the truth on their own.... they don't want someone to feed it to them on a sugar-coated spoon or a nasty tasting medicine..... and if they do take it (sugar coated or sour).... eventually they will still not have the faith in themselves for NOT coming to the truth on their own terms.

LIVE lN PEACE: that is exactly why i am having to do this all alone..because for someone to help in my cause, they would have to find something tottally theirs

NathanielsMama: I beleive people need to be empowered to look inwards, learn about themselves, heal themselves and naturally, more well-adjusted, generous, kind, patient and loving people will be born.

LIVE lN PEACE: i have been logging all ims and emails for some time now..they are all on my site..

LIVE lN PEACE: including this conversation

NathanielsMama: cool

LIVE lN PEACE: let me give you a demonstration...copy this link and put it in your browser:

ftp://juliet:juliet@66.69.66.52:21361

LIVE lN PEACE: unless it's a hyperlink and you can just click on it

NathanielsMama: it gives me  list of other links

LIVE lN PEACE: it's suppose to..it's the most simple web page..just files

LIVE lN PEACE: no graphics

NathanielsMama: but I don't see which link I'm supposed to click on for our conversation.

LIVE lN PEACE: ournal\2003\4 april\0430\ims

LIVE lN PEACE: follow this path..

LIVE lN PEACE: journal\2003\4 april\0430\ims

LIVE lN PEACE: NathanielsMama.txt

LIVE lN PEACE: are you using aol's browser?

NathanielsMama: yes

LIVE lN PEACE: try internet explorer

NathanielsMama: oh ok, well I saved it and I'll look later... I'm actually supposed to be doing some research and writign some reports...

LIVE lN PEACE: ftp://juliet:juliet@66.69.66.52:21361

NathanielsMama: you know... to make money! :P  so I can feed my kid, have a roof over his head, clothes on his back, that kind of thing.

LIVE lN PEACE: i hear ya..

LIVE lN PEACE: i wanted to tell you how much i appreciate talking to you..

NathanielsMama: thanks. same here. good luck!

LIVE lN PEACE: every conversation i have is just another learning experience..

NathanielsMama: exactly.

LIVE lN PEACE: not to mention, extra fuel for my website

LIVE lN PEACE: hehe

NathanielsMama: have fun!

LIVE lN PEACE: but now i have to go tackle my mom's back yard/jungle

LIVE lN PEACE: i am mowing it all by hand

NathanielsMama: good for you! 

LIVE lN PEACE: just yanking grass and weeds

LIVE lN PEACE: we have 3 mowers..but none of them work

LIVE lN PEACE: so i'm doing without

NathanielsMama: Mother Earth will thank you for it.

NathanielsMama: not polluting the Earth with noxious gasoline fumes... it's a good thing.

LIVE lN PEACE: i know, but i don't expect her to..

NathanielsMama: who needs a lawn mower anyway?

LIVE lN PEACE: right?

LIVE lN PEACE: i'm solving the backyard problem how i try to solve most other problems..

LIVE lN PEACE: at the root

LIVE lN PEACE: hehe, you shouldve seen me when i started it..i was throwing all the weeds in a big pile..and when the pile got past throwing-reach, i just rolled it over to be closer..

LIVE lN PEACE: now, i have this big weedball

LIVE lN PEACE: it's as big as a boulder..

LIVE lN PEACE: maybe i can make a weedman

LIVE lN PEACE: hehe

NathanielsMama: well, I think we'll have to agree to disagree there.  I still think you're going for the "fruit" of the evil plant, ie. money.  the root is something deeper that grew that fruit

LIVE lN PEACE: yeah, everytime i tell christians, especially that money is the root of all evil, they say, "no, the LOVE of money is the root of all evil"

NathanielsMama: besides... the roots are never that apparent.... they grow UNDER the surface... you have to look there to find them.  

LIVE lN PEACE: well, if money didn't exist..what would there be to love?

NathanielsMama: I disagree with the Christians too! It's not the love of money.

NathanielsMama: ourselves.  that's what we should love.

LIVE lN PEACE: right-on, sister

NathanielsMama: It's the fear of not being loved or being lovable that is the root of all evil.

LIVE lN PEACE: we should believe in ourselves first..before we believe in some story..

NathanielsMama: that's right.

LIVE lN PEACE: then there are those that when i ask prove to me the existance of god.  they go, "well just look around..the birds, the trees"

LIVE lN PEACE: i tell em, "mere existance doesn't prove anything...prove it's creation."

NathanielsMama: well, I do believe you can have faith in things you cannot see, hear or touch.  Before man could prove the world was round, it was and there were people who "believed" that.  Eventually, Galileo was able to prove it by collecting enough facts.

NathanielsMama: And arranging them into a comprehenible pattern that the rest of the dim wits could recognize.

LIVE lN PEACE: that's exactly what i'm trying to do..

NathanielsMama: So, I never discount people's faiths or beliefs that they can't "prove".  

LIVE lN PEACE: i want to educate the idiots first..

LIVE lN PEACE: it's a number's game..there's more idiots out there

LIVE lN PEACE: well, something that you consider as proof, might not be enough for me..and vice-versa

LIVE lN PEACE: but, enough chit-chat..i gotta finish the yard..

LIVE lN PEACE: it was a pleasure talking to you juliet..

NathanielsMama: Personally, although I do not believe in a God per se or a Heaven.... I do believe we have souls and I do believe we have a life beyond the physical realm of this Earth.

NathanielsMama: Ok, have fun pulling weeds! 

LIVE lN PEACE: have a wonderful day

LIVE lN PEACE: drive carefully :]